008.5 - The Deep Dive - Sangam x Kid Smpl - Notes and Interview

 

The deep dive is for readers who want to dig further into the album by reading the notes and pre-review interview that is done with each artist.  It is best read after the review.

 

Notes

Brave Warrior -

0-1:30 - The track starts out with a distorted sound of some sort of city ambience and with a woman's voice.  The distorted city sounds continue as a soft synth lead comes in over a pad.  Someone saying "we found a way" keeps leading the song forward and is soon joined by a melodic female voice that has been altered somehow, making it sound not entirely human.  The melody continues and really has quite a bleak tone to it, that's really going to be the tone for everything from this point forward, bleak and without hope.  

1:31-3:00 - At 1:30 the section fades out and transitions to part two of the song.  A few vocal samples of a woman saying "we have our walls" or "we have our orders" I can't tell exactly.  A breakbeat comes in, similar to jungle beats at the turn of the millennium.  Actually this whole part of the composition really reminds me of jungle, minimal synth pads over very active drums.  Melodic female vocals come over again and they have the same effect as the previous ones where they don't sound quite human but are very discernible.

3:01-4:30 - At 3:00 in we transition to part 3.  The start of this is some very subdued ambient with a pitch shifted version of the breakbeat cutting in and out in a very abrupt and jarring fashion.  What sounds like a very abrupt beeping sounds changes channels very readily in waves. The beat slowly fades in and then again abruptly ends and the synths lead us into part 4.  

4:31-7:05 - Huge synth pads lead this section of the song with a deep and warming sound, probably the calmest that the track has been to this point.  Even though the sound is warm there is still a sense of loss here, a sense of mourning.  Rain and what sounds like a distorted trumpet dot the background.  Eventually the "trumpet" sound morphs into something more like a typical synth, and a woman says "this is not the end." Her voice has a similar filter on it to the melodic voice in the beginning of part 3.  This is the longest section so far of the song, lasting over two minutes.  At 7 minutes we finally fade out and are transitioned into part 5 of the song.  

7:06-9:17 - A disjointed beat begins the next section and has some sound effects that have heavy reverb on them.  The whole section is very mechanical and has almost no sense of melody until about 8 minutes in when the synths really pick up and accompany the industrial sounds, it almost has a wall of sound effect and builds very well throughout its duration.  As quickly as it builds up it gets torn down and by 9 minutes into the song we are well on our way to part 6.  

9:18-12:12 - City streets and deep low humming noise start part 6.  There is no melody and no beat, only the sound of static and what sounds like tape noise in the background.  Rain eventually joins in to call in the melodic portion of this part.  The rain continues but soft synth leads wrap the listener in a beautiful sound.  Three separate patterns are on display one high pitch, one in the middle range and one low.  They all compliment each other well and end the track on a melodic note.

Overview - I'm not sure what all of this means, it's like there are 7 different ideas forced into one long track.  Is this because there is an overarching theme to the track.  There are points where the percussion is frantic and the synths are peaceful, and there are points where the percussion is non existent and the synths carry the weight of the song.  After watching the official video there seems to be some kind of story going on here maybe involving some kind of soldiers? If this is the brave warrior I would love to know the story behind it and what is being told musically here.  I would also love to know why all of these concepts are in one long track rather than a few smaller tracks.

Basin Cradle -

0:01-1:04 - Distorted city sounds begin part one of this track, ambience you would hear just walking down a street, but something is just a little bit off.  33 seconds in we're ripped from anything that is normal and taken into a dreamscape of synths, a reverbed chime plays sparse notes over a warm synth pad for 30 seconds and just as quickly as we are put into it we are ripped out and forced into another part.  

1:05-2:20 - 1 minute in we have another dual synth lead, one playing lower single notes to accent the higher melody.  Around 1:49 another lead comes in to compliment the main synth lead. It is highly distorted and has some sort of voice with it that I can't understand.  

2:21-4:16 - At 2:20 it ends and takes us back into the city ambience.  2:30 begins another melody that starts and ends very quickly and then slowly comes back in about 10 seconds later as the ambience begins to fade.  The synth pad comes in very tentatively and some distorted tones are in the background.  The city ambience returns right around three minutes and includes the clearest picture on the album so far of people talking... just for a moment.  Someone is singing over the synth pads and melody but again there is a distortion on the voice where I can't make out exactly what is going on.  

4:16-7:30 - By 4 minutes, all of the ambience and other effects have left the song and only the synths remain... then they too are gone.  By 4:30 there is just a low tone and a distant beeping, like an EKG.  A voice interrupts the near silence and then at 5 minutes we get another melodic section for a few moments before rain comes in. As the rain continues the noise slowly fades into the background and the music swells into a nearly angelic tone.  Everything though still has that veil of sadness to it.  All of the melodies so far on the album are very simple but well executed, this really is well put together.  The melody that started at 5 minutes continues for another few minutes.  I was really surprised with how long they let this section linger based on how quickly everything else to this point is ushered out.  Finally at 7:15 the rain stops abruptly rather than fading out and the synths are out by 7:30.  

7:31-9:00 - A single tone resembling speaker feedback remains with static over it.  This is like the ashes that are left from the melodic section and harken darker times to come.  Those dark times take the tone of a deep synth around 8:10 into the song and they continue droning in a deliberately slow fashion for another 30 seconds before the city sounds return with the EKG sound again.  

9:01-11:01 - "where am I" says a male voice and it's quickly joined by a synth line that reminds me of something out of terminator 2.  A female voice keeps chanting "you have been detained."   The final melodic section of the song keeps swelling and building until about 10:30 and finally fades out to random noises of objects hitting each other or something similar.

Overview - The story that is presented in this one is either directly related to the previous one or not related at all.  While the first track has a lot of jarring transitions and some very defined beats, there is almost nothing like that in this track.  There are a lot of city sounds in between the synth sections.  There does seem to be several characters at play here.  The male voice I think is the brave warrior from the first track and there is another character who has the melodic female voice.  What role she plays I don't know, I don't even know if she is human based off of the distortions used on her voice.  The whole feeling so far on this album is inhuman, even the sections that are warm have a very synthetic feel to them.  The sections of the songs keep jumping from "scene" to "scene" as if searching for something.

Ruined Prophet -

0:01-2:15 - Low garbled noise and a sigh start the song right before a gentle synth starts out for a few notes.  It's quickly joined by distorted city noises and another synth line changing the whole atmosphere of the first 15 seconds. An obscured voice says something like "You are alive" or "you are life."  This mantra repeats throughout the first part of the song.  About a minute in another melody plays really far in the background and is hard to hear.  I had to listen several times to make sure I was hearing correctly.  The music fades and is replaced by the rhythmic humming of a machine and a two note synth with some static until about 2:15 when everything drops.

2:16-4:30 - A garbled sound of someone engaging a lever or some kind of device repeats over and over, one time in the left channel and then it's reciprocated by a similar noise in the other channel.  You are life repeats one last time and finally we get some musical accompaniment.  A gentle synth lead playing whole notes (not sure, can't tell the meter) slowly leads the listener into a serene section.  The garbled sounds drop and eventually the woman with the distorted voice begins to speak over the music.  

4:31-7:00 - By 4:30 its all gone very quickly and its replaced by ominous sounding noises... a saw running well in the background... someone walking on gravel... its hard to tell whats going on but the atmosphere is tense.  The synths reengage around 5:15 and they are slow again, though very different in tone than the past section.  The female voice continues to call out briefly every now and then. At 6:15 we get what can only be described as an angelic melody... it changes the tone of the song.. giving it a sense of otherworldliness.  

7:01-8:30 - As quickly as they are added they are removed and we hear a female voice say "we meant for the pains we suffer" or something similar.  The voice is the clearest that has been on the album to this point.  A strong beat and a male voice starts up the next section and the pace quickly picks up.  The beat settles into a 4 on the floor pattern and different sounds are layered over a synth pad, the whole thing is ominous and urgent in nature.  A female voice, clear as day says "people have changed."  I wonder why now all the sudden the voices don't have effects on them.  

8:31-10:26 - The synths eventually take over around 8:45 and the "people have changed" mantra is repeated over and over.  This section again really reminds me of T2, that fully mechanical dystopian future sound is really captured well here.  Eventually it fades out around 10 minutes and a distorted female voice playfully sings over it, the sounds of kids laughing is briefly heard before they are violently stopped mid sample.  The song ends with a lone synth.  

Overview - I am almost sure that this album is telling some sort of story at this point.  There is just too much of a musical narrative going on for this all to be coincidance.  I'm pretty sure the main character is the male.  He has been disconnected from the world for some time and there is a female character who helps him understand what is going on.  I don't know if the female is real or in his head, an artificial intelligence or something else but she seems to be acting as some sort of guide.  There is another character as well, the distorted female voice that comes at the end of the song has such a different tone than anything else that it has to be symbolic of something or someone else.  I'm extremely curious what the composers were thinking when making this.

Hazel Smoke -

0:01-1:47 - Synths that have a super familiar tone, I can't place them but I think its from some VGM somewhere, starting off the song along with that distorted female voice begging us to stay.  With the way the previous song ended I really wonder what is being told here.  This whole section is charged with emotion and desperation despite the synths being so calm.  I really like this part.  The clear female voice says "I can fix this'' and then we are ushered into the second part around 1:47 into the song.  

1:48-3:40 - Similar styled synths are used but the main melody has a bit more of a sense of urgency to it.  A beat joins in shortly after, though its not as urgent as the synths are... an interesting choice.  The beat leaves as quickly as it came and the synths drop out one after another until about 3:40 when a low tone takes over.  

3:41-6:30 - There is a single synth pad and some distant sounds of beeping in the background.  The synth abruptly stops and an entirely new section starts with synth strings and another melody that cries urgency.  About 4:50 into the song deep tones act as an accompaniment to what sounds like maybe a very distant voice.  The distorted female voice offers a brief melody over all of the sounds briefly.  This really makes me wonder what is going on here... is the main character faced with a tough decision? Whatever this section signifies it is important... that much is clearly communicated.

6:31-8:45 - At 6:30 a lone synth tone takes us into the next section, moving us away from the huge sound in the previous one.  This is accompanied by street sounds and rain and eventually introduces a subtle synth melody in the background.  A warm synth pad takes the leading role after another minute or so... this is probably the most soothing the album has been to this point... maybe a release to the tension build up of the previous section?  "The war has ended, sexual sufferings aside" "let there be no doubt we will walk the path of true peace" these sounds open up the next section.  The sounds of a city at night in the rain play in the background.

8:46-10:46 -A very similar sound to the start of the album takes hold around 9 minutes... a synthesized pan flute plays a lonesome melody.  Reminiscence and loss seem to be the tone here.  If this war is over and the main character is a warrior, what point is there left for him? What was lost in this war? All of these things seem to weigh heavily on us as the album fades out.  The album ends with a man sighing.

Overall - Man what an ending.  Everything that the album has built towards just ends with a mournful whimper... like "what was the point of it all?" What happened to all these characters? The main character seems to have lived, but what about all the other ones? Lots of questions, not many answers... love it.

--------

Kid Smpl Response to Notes

Thanks for sending these notes over. It's really cool to see the release plotted out like this and it's a really thoughtful look at the whole thing. I have a feeling you'll ask about these things in the questions you send but I noticed you were wondering about some things in your notes so I wrote up some stuff that will hopefully help to clear those things up. Started with your general overviews and then cleared up some of the timed notes.

First big thing to note - when Sangam and I first started working on tracks together we wanted to make stuff that was VERY cinematic, basically to the extent that I think of our tracks pretty much like the audio tracks of movies that don't exist. So I tend to think of the tracks as a series of "scenes" and this is expressed in the use of dialogue/monologue sounding samples, abrupt changes into parts that could just be their own song, very still moments, etc. I think a lot of the speaking samples (especially on this release) tend to play off of sci-fi tropes but that's not to say they don't lean towards certain themes, it's just that there's this overarching, more cerebral thing going on because we wanted to make really cinematic tracks. I think you're correct that the release in general has a pretty bleak feeling to it, but I think of it as having more of a bleak setting with some glimmers of hope here and there, this is probably most obvious in the transition from the first few sections of the title track to the section with the more uplifting synths and the sample that says "This is not the end. You belong." I think of that moment as the conclusion of a quiet, interpersonal moment between two characters that are finding some sort of meaning in the chaos. In general I think that the thing that's connecting all the tracks is that they feel that they're all in the same setting but telling different stories about different characters. The video for "Brave Warrior" plays off of that too. I have a quick description from Rick Farin who directed the video:

"‘Brave Warrior’ follows a cast of characters as they traverse through a world transformed; a digital space that constructs a hybrid between nature and technology, utilizing 3D scanning and Brutalist architecture influences in its construction. Our characters are shrouded, carrying on their backs equipment of an unknown use; perhaps they are evolved archaeologists, excavating through a hypernatural digital wasteland. As we move through, the tension of the world rises, finally waking us up to a fiery conclusion; a space lit aflame in which we find our compassion for one another."

This is of course Rick's interpretation, but I think it's a really good one. Your specific interpretation of it being a journey between just two characters is really cool btw and as I'm listening back to release I totally see it but tbh I thought of the whole narrative as having a bunch of characters and we're just getting glimpses into moments between them. Hope that all makes sense for the overall themes lol. Looking forward to the questions and of course I'm sure Sangam has stuff to add.

For the timed notes:

Brave Warrior:
1:31-3:00 - The sample actually says "we found our world". I think your interpretation works thematically with this though in that it's saying the setting has it's determined limits, order, etc.

Basin Cradle:
1:05-2:20 - The sample just says "I can't". Probably a bit dramatic lol but as I said above we're playing off these personal moments.
9:01-11:01 - The sample actually says "New entity." So you're right that it's supposed to give off the vibe of more of a disembodied, robotic being but it's more depicting that being detecting someone rather than detaining them.

Ruined Prophet:
0:01-2:15 - "You are alive" is the sample.
7:01-8:30 - It's "No matter the pains we suffer" but ya you got the idea right there, it's the beginning of a dark moment lol.

Hazel Smoke:
6:31-8:45 - The sample is "When war has ended so too will suffering subside." Second part is correct.
--------


Interview with Kid Smpl and Sangam 

Kid Smpl

Here are my answers. You'll notice on a couple of them I just copied and pasted something from my last email cause I thought it was the best explanation. Let me know if there's anything you need me to clear up and obviously Sangam will probably have more to add to the answers for the general questions.

Shadow Knight has varying lengths to the songs while Brave Warrior has song lengths all between 10-12 minutes.  Was Brave Warrior structured this way for the requirements to be on Display (10-15 minute long songs)?

Yep. This release was written with the intention of coming out on DISPLAY so we kept that in mind when structuring things out.

Many of the songs seem like they could be broken up into smaller 3-4 minute tracks.  Why we’re so many starkly different sections combined together under one track?

When Sangam and I first started working on tracks together we wanted to make stuff that was VERY cinematic, basically to the extent that I think of our tracks pretty much like the audio tracks of movies that don't exist. So I tend to think of the tracks as a series of "scenes" and this is expressed in the use of dialogue/monologue sounding samples, abrupt changes into parts that could just be their own song, very still moments, etc.

You two have released several albums together, including the year long process Remembrance Phase.  How did you two start collaborating so consistently and what is your song writing process like?

Our process is pretty straight forward. Basically for me Sangam sends over a few loops (always 3 at this point since it seems to be just the right amount) all stemmed out. These loops would probably sound a lot like a Sangam track to some folks, just a bit more raw and loopy. Then I take those bits and structure them out into more sprawling tracks, usually edit the structures of them a bit, add my own parts + effects on top, sometimes take some things out, make more droned out versions of them, work on transitions between sections, etc. Also if the track feels like it calls for it, sometimes I just create a new section on my own, or just use the loop Sangam sent me raw and don't touch it at all but I'd say most of the time it's like the first method I described and leads to a sound that feels very 50/50 of our own individual sounds.

We’ve already established that there is a narrative around Shadow Knight and Brave Warrior, in whatever detail you want to go into can  you describe the story that is going on?  

Ya and it's rounded out with a third album that isn't out yet. I wouldn't say the series has a fully plotted out narrative, more like a series of three different narrative settings in the same universe if that makes sense? Basically the details of the narrative are intentionally a bit blurry but hopefully the music really takes you to its setting and you fill in the blanks yourself, it's kind of passive in its storytelling. Like for Brave Warrior, the release in general has a pretty bleak feeling to it and hopefully puts you in that setting, but I think of that bleak setting as having some glimmers of hope here and there, this is probably most obvious in the transition from the first few sections of the title track, which are pretty dark, to the section with the more uplifting synths and the sample that says "This is not the end. You belong." I think of that moment as the conclusion of a quiet, interpersonal moment between two characters that are finding some sort of meaning in the chaos. So in general I think that the thing that's connecting all the tracks is that they feel that they're all in the same setting but telling different stories about different characters like the one I just mentioned.

How many characters are in the story and how are they represented in the albums? There seems to be a leitmotif for at least one of the characters (the distorted female voice from the notes).  Are there other more subtle things going on that I may have missed?

I think of the whole narrative as having a bunch of characters that are connected by the setting. Like on Brave Warrior as I stated above, they exist in this bleak world but are trying to find some shred of hope in it. I think that commonality is what shapes the narrative feel. Like you're correct in thinking that there's sort of a roller coaster of feelings and events throughout the album but I don't think of it all happening with one character, rather a broad group and the narrative is formed around their shared experience.

At several parts of the album the synth lead or sample will just abruptly stop.  Was this a stylistic choice or just something that just ended up happening?

This is playing off of the general cinematic approach I mentioned before, that feeling of the music being the audio track of a movie that doesn't exist. It creates an abrupt cut, change of scene, etc. Like one thing I often do when making cuts like that is also change the more atmospheric, field recording type sounds in the background, kind of implying that we're in a different space now.

Why was Hazel Smoke excluded from the vinyl release?

This is basically for boring technical reasons lol. If it were to be included it would have had to be a double vinyl release and that just wasn't in the budget for DISPLAY unfortunately.

Shadow Knight and Brave Warrior are the first two parts of a trilogy, when can we expect the third installment?

Not sure on that currently but I can confirm that that album is done.

---------

Kid Smpl Specific Questions

You run Display which has a simple mission statement: people invited to put out a release on the label must create songs between 10-15 minutes.  

How did you arrive on this requirement?

It was initially conceived from my love of long-form tracks. Things like Burial's "Rival Dealer" and a lot of the music he's released since then and I just wanted to hear more artists working that way so I started the label with that requirement.
 
Has it changed any artist’s creative process that you have invited to be on the label?
 
I can't speak for their process after they release on the label but I know it tends to lead artists to feel they can experiment more, like they can let moments breathe a lot more cause they just have more time to say what they want, they might also be able to do stuff that they wouldn't necessarily want to be a stand alone track on an album or EP but makes sense for just a brief moment in a 10min+ long track. This has also led me to encourage artists to experiment a bit more too. Like on our latest release from Thugwidow he kind of split his sound in half, with the a-side being all drums and bass, and the b-side being an ambient track.
 
-------
 
Sangam Specific Questions
 
On Shadow Knight, Brave Warrior and Remembrance Phrase you guys have a very distinct style that is a departure from your own.  How did you settle in on this style and how do you see it developing further in future collaborations?


Me and Kid Smpl have known each other for a good amount of years now. From his early style to now we’ve always thought about making music together. As big fans of emotional electronic music we’ve always had the same taste in music and understand each other connecting through emotions in music. When we first started on ’Shadow Knight’ (Dream Catalogue) the idea came to mind from Kid Smpl about making the track longer with different sections bit like Burial did with some of his most recent works. Naturally it’s fairly easy for us to come up with tracks and having so much experience over the years with DAW. It just works really well, we’ve never had a disagreement about the arrangement of our tracks. Started to open up as a special place for my mind our tracks are really the reality of the longing for something in real life. We basically agreed to make tracks for life as they truly means a lot to me. I feel these tracks take me to another space when times feel bad. I think we both get excited and look forward to making tunes together as it just works so great. I’m blessed to know Kid Smpl and make history with him.



Shadow Knight has varying lengths to the songs while Brave Warrior has song lengths all between 10-12 minutes.  
Was Brave Warrior structured this way for the requirements to be on Display (10-15 minute long songs)? 

Most of the time we just keep adding ideas to a track on ’Shadow Knight’, until we felt like it had an ending to the journey. I feel like your inserting a chip inside the mind when listening to our tracks that 10-12 mins it’s dedication from the listener. We wanted the tracks to be a journey with all the different sections the listener is able to experience all types of emotions and picture different thoughts/places in there head. Plans to put ‘Brave Warrior’ on Vinyl so we had to make sure the timing was right to fit on the 12’’

You possess a distinctive, recognizable sound that has an immediate effect upon the listener.  What are your emotions, thoughts, and ideas that act as the creative well-spring for your music?  Where does your music come from?

My music is basically like my inner soul pushing through my hands and spilling emotions from my mind on to a rainy sound diary, if that makes sense. Naturally I Load up my DAW and a strain of emotion releases within. I’ve always related more to sad and soothing sounds. Something with meaning and sort of a grip of things happenings in my life at the time.

Most artists leave the meaning of their music to the listener.  However, with such vast and consistent body of work are there any particular ideas or sensations that you would hope people derive from your material?  Is there anything you are trying to communicate or put out into the world with your music?

Aswell as myself enjoying my own sound, I feel like it can be healing for any listener in ways of helping deal with depression and emptiness inside. You kinda get a grip on a tough situation your facing in your head whilst listening my stuff can make you reel out the emotions. I’ve had tons of messages over the years from people saying how my music has changed there life or even helped them to not take there own life. It’s blessing to communicate my sound and emotions to the world.

You have recently revealed you’ve never sought compensation for your work.  Why have you taken this position?  Does it come from a personal philosophy you have about creativity, or from some other place?

When I first was making music it came out of interest for a certain sound. I was mostly enjoying the likes of burial, Tim Hecker, Bvdub. I started finding strains of this sound through soundcloud. I began to make music and get in touch with producers doing the same thing. Once I began to build a name amongst the other artists I was around at the time . I started to release music a lot amongst the creative led me into releasing my stuff on floppy disk, cassette, CD and Vinyl. I always knew a lot of people who was releasing my stuff on physical was just people like me enjoying the sound and they had genuine interest and not much money was to be made. So for the sake of the growth of labels I just took Merch instead and just rather see the labels grow. It’s honor in a way to release music with labels. I was more about the love and connects amongst people instead of just focusing on the money. Something that I enjoy and influencing other people with my sound. I believe being a electronic musician should more so about the passion rather that eyes on the money first. I believe building bridges with people and expanding the sound. The ones that enjoy it will always be passionate about it.